Invite Communities In

Marcus: There's a kind of shared hunger, right? Especially during times that are characterized by uncertainty and complexity. Our folks are hungry for something. You know, they want a little extra sauce.

Aisha: There's a deep hunger, or a deep longing, amongst community members for real change. And in order to fulfill that hunger, then the community members need to be invited into the kitchen.

Marcus: Yes. Yes.

Aisha: They need to contribute to the ingredients. They need to be a part of the solution. And so at NFF, being community-centered is a part of our special sauce. It is who we are and what we do. We understand that nonprofits are central in the community, that they hold the relationships, that they know best how to use the resources, how to activate the networks that are in community.

And they have vision. They have aspiration. And so it is very important for organizations that steward capital to honor those aspirations. To trust that if we come together in a community design approach, a community design focus, that what we're going to see is effective solutions for communities.

Marcus: I love it. One of the reasons – one of the many reasons – I'm so excited about this conversation is because what you described aligns so much with our community-driven philanthropy framework, right? And so there are all types of different ways to describe this – we were talking about trust-based philanthropy and purpose-driven leadership – but all of it really, as I was saying, describes this focus of the people.

If I can go back to the analogy of being in the kitchen: The way I think about this community centered, driven, focused, approach to our work is making sure that everyone has an apron. That you have the spatula, you know the really fancy spatula–

Aisha: Yeah, the proper kitchen tools.

Marcus: Yeah, you don't want to be like, at home in my kitchen where I'm using a fork to flip over the pancakes – I'm balancing things. But there are appropriate tools for the task.

Aisha: Yes. Yes.

Marcus: And we have a sous chef, and we have the folks that are – and everyone is clear about their roles. When we approach our work in community in that same way, then there's a similar kind of harmony and a joy in the process itself, and not just the meal. And you know, where I’m from we talk about infusing love into what we do, right? And why wouldn't that be the same case in this instance, in the kitchen of our communities?

Aisha: Yes. Yes. I really love that.

Aisha: Access to capital is critical to moving forward the natural resources, talents, the wisdom that you talked about, to bring to full fulfillment the vision that community has. When we think about access to capital, the capital itself has to be designed in a way that can be absorbed by community.

Marcus: Yeah, please say more about that.

Aisha: So, you know, I've worked in institutions where we've come up with this great product – I won't name the institutions – but we've come up with these great products and then there's no uptake, right?

Marcus: Yeah, yeah. Same.

Aisha: The dollars are not being deployed because there was no communication and no co-design with community to understand if it was the right type of capital, or if the product was being structured in the right way. Or perhaps the capital was too expensive and we didn't think about the power then of collaborating with community foundations or other foundations or maybe government to bring down the cost of that capital through grants or through program related investments, which might also then enhance innovation, right?

Because now we are thinking about doing things a different way, and we can get a different result – because when you try new things, then you're actually going to see change happen. So I think it's very important when we think about power, that we also include the concept of access – access to capital – but also access to resources, access to information. Being able to have a platform to share what is working and what is not working.

Marcus: What we've learned through the GEO community is that a shared fate is more aligned with how conditions that exist today have become how they are, historically, right? The policies, the practices that influence access like you just described, have everything to do with what we’re dealing with right now.

Aisha: That’s right.

Marcus: But at GEO we say – and – let's take our time and support the individual to move through the discomfort of that change process. Let's address the fear that sometimes goes unspoken and becomes a barrier to collaboration. Let's name it. Let's bring everything to the surface. Let's put it on the table so that we're operating with intention around all of the different dynamics that are at play in any relationship.

So providing an opportunity and learning how to be in the business of engaging with difference. With, you know, maybe it’s not agreement that we need in order to identify pathways for access, but it’s alignment, right? If we’re moving in the same direction, then the potential for realizing a kind of shared set of results is still accessible. It’s still possible.

Aisha: I think about the difference of foundations that have community advisory boards and those that don't, and how they're able to then make that connection and really move forward in ways that realizes that we are all going for the same goal of community well-being.

Marcus: How about that.

Aisha: And the way that the foundation may have been doing it without the support of the advisory board was well-intentioned, but did not take into consideration what the needs, the desires, the aspirations of community members are. So I think community advisory boards are a good approach. Have you seen any other best practices?

Marcus: Yeah, you know, there's so many. What I love about the question is that it invites a co-design, co-creation of the different groups that we just described to respond to the particular context that is either regional, geographic in nature. And those are different contexts in which we consider what access looks like, what purpose looks like, right? Even what fulfillment looks like. Sometimes we can talk about it in rural versus urban contexts.

But all of this to me says, you know, bringing people together meaningfully. And so what we call it can change from place to place. And it can be a community board structure on the East Coast. And it can be, more of, town hall in Ohio, in Cleveland where I’m from. But in both cases, it’s, you know, what fits the culture of the place.

Aisha: Alright, so let's talk about power sharing.

Marcus: Okay.

Aisha: So this notion of shared power really defies the traditional practices and dynamics that have been practiced by philanthropy. And I think that some are intimidated and threatened by it. Some are just uncomfortable. Some really don't understand what we mean by shared power. So can you speak to what you've seen and what you've learned?

Marcus: I can, thank you. First, to talk about power, I want to simplify and demystify, if I may. All of these terms, what we're really getting into is a core, fundamental, genuine relationship. It’s being in relationship as recipient of resources and purveyor, provider of resources toward thriving. We want everyone involved in the broader set of relationships that we are part of to contribute to their own well-being, to fulfill a shared sense of well-being, right? So power is one's ability to fulfill purpose, right? Dr. King said it best.

Aisha: Yes.

Marcus: And so if you think about what is it that – what are the steps I can take to actualize a sense of purpose and experience it through the different relationships I'm a part of? That's what we mean by a power experience. So we all have access to a certain level of power. I can realize the vision that I have for power for myself as an individual on some level independently.

Aisha: Yes.

Marcus: But we all know that when two or more of us come together, so much more as possible. And so power and possibility connect to purpose, when we are thinking about this more community-centered approach to philanthropy. When we think about moving beyond the traditional forces that brought philanthropy into play a hundred or more years ago.

It’s really about our ability to explore what’s possible together, bring in different resources to bear. And in spaces and groups like GEO, we offer a platform where we’re intentional about identifying with those resources are. And we offer a way of exchanging, sharing information, in order to move toward an acknowledgment of like, “Oh, we have this in common,” toward a shared vision for thriving. So that’s something we often don’t have, is clarity around a vision.

Marcus: How are nonprofits from what you are experiencing, observing, what are they experiencing? How are they feeling?

Aisha: The pressure on nonprofits is significant. And so they're feeling everything from fear and anxiety to anger and resentment. And we've been through the pandemic, and the impacts of the pandemic are still being felt. Nonprofits were first responders. These are frontline community organizations.

Marcus: Yes, that’s right, I think we forget that too.

Aisha: Yeah, we forget that they were bearing the burden often without any compensation.

Marcus: Right.

Aisha: And I think about one of our clients who was able to respond very quickly. The ED describes themselves as a speedboat and not a steamship. And not just that organization, but all small community nonprofits, because they can be nimble, they can act quickly, they can pivot. And this particular organization, which supplies books, was able to quickly then also distribute food and PPE to the community. And they have the relationships that are important in community, with the individual community members, with the other nonprofits, with the religious institutions, right? So they've got that trust and then they're able to respond very quickly.

But even for those organizations, it's been a pile-on. And then the macro-economic factors with inflation and rising interest rates, and now the environment that we find ourselves in where contracts are threatened, nonprofits have really been stressed. And so I think it's important for philanthropy to step up its commitment. We all, we all have a responsibility, government, all stakeholders need to come together.

Marcus: For sure. Well, so that's really important. I think my colleagues in the systems change world would talk about cycles of change. And so what I heard you describe is yet another cycle of societal change that we find ourselves in. The beauty of it is – and it does offer a kind of hopefulness to it – is that we can always refer to another cycle, a previous cycle of change for some examples of what to bring into the current or emerging cycle that we find ourselves in.

What we find in our approach at GEO is to really honor the complexity of moments, appreciating that they are all happening inside of these cycles of change that recur. Each cycle looks slightly different in terms of its shape, its texture, the impact of the activities. But we can … they resemble, there are through lines that allow us to revisit what we didn't address fully in previous cycles.

Aisha: Yes.

Marcus: So, again that’s the hope of it. But honoring complexity allows us to say, you know what, grantmakers feel the same thing that you just described with nonprofits. Grantmakers experience, from our observation, that same kind of fear. Several experience anger. And trust, if you’ve see one philanthropy, one grantmaker, you’ve seen one grantmaker, right? Everyone’s different. So we are careful to not paint anyone or characterize anyone monolithically. And there’s hope in that too, right? Because there’s change – change is possible for all of us, we’re all learning.

Marcus: What grantmakers who have adopted this use of data, this attending to power, this flexibility – they have said, “You know what? We noticed that those frontline nonprofits can benefit from having those resources sooner. So, let's not be so restrictive with our grantmaking cycles, and let’s release the funds early.”

Aisha: Well that's a trust-based practice that we saw happening more frequently during the pandemic and in the wake of George Floyd's murder. But, we've seen a retrenchment from that. We haven't seen those practices operating as frequently as they should.

And so I believe that we need to invite philanthropy back in and say – it is very important that we unrestrict the funds. That we think about paperwork and streamlining the application process, about advancing funds instead of just putting them out on a reimbursement basis.

Marcus: That’s right, loan packages.

Aisha: I think it's important that we continue to have those conversations. And, you know, while we talk about these cycles and what nonprofits are experiencing, I just want to be able to say that nonprofit leaders and those that have been called into this work have an indomitable spirit. We are resilient.

Marcus: Truly.

Aisha: We have stories of how we have overcome the surmounting challenges over the years. So I would like to invite funders back into those practices in this moment that we’re in where the stress that nonprofits are facing is really insurmountable.

Marcus: I really appreciate how you mentioned the previous cycle of change that's most present to me, which was the pandemic – and how there were so many shifts in the approaches of grantmaking that are kind of aligned with trust-based practices. And the hope that I described of the recurring cycles of change, the through lines, is that we can improve upon those.

Those kinds of interventions, those trust-based in nature, the flexible and reliable funding are important first steps. And those are insufficient for closing the gaps that we're talking about. And that this time around we get to do it better. This time around, from the onset we get to speak across sectors. We get to have the conversations behind the scenes with our private sector partners and align around values, our public sector partners and align around values. We get to get a clearer sense of what the challenges are across those sectors and pool our collective thinking in addition to our financial resources.

Because philanthropy is just a drop in the bucket, although we have an outsized narrative for the impact of what’s possible with philanthropic dollars alone. And so we just want to appreciate that philanthropy is best when seen inside of a broader set of resources that exist across sectors. And that the largest pool of resources exists outside of philanthropy, in the public sector in particular.

Aisha: I agree, but I am thinking that what is important for us right now is to be stewards of what is in our immediate control.

Marcus: That's absolutely right.

Aisha: You know, when I think of, examples that have worked really well, is that, you know, we've worked with a community land trust that was able to purchase an apartment building and to rehab it for affordable housing.

Marcus: Yes.

Aisha: And so this enabled them to take it off the speculative market and put it in the hands of community, turning it to community control. Well, this was in part done by a financial institution deciding that they wanted to do something different and to provide funding to us that would allow us to put out 0% capital.

Marcus: That’s beautiful.

Aisha: Right, so I think that there's ways to be more creative, more innovative, that doesn't require sign-off from boards and trustees. You know, it rests with decision makers that can contribute to immediate change.

Marcus: And you made the point that is so important for all of us to consider. We can talk about PRIs, MRIs, these investment packages that can be used by grantmaking institutions to offer resources at very low interest rates or no interest. And to deviate from the traditional practices of the institutions requires what we all generally refer to as leadership.

Aisha: Yes.

Marcus: It’s courage. To break away from the norm has an emotional impact on grantmakers in a way that sometimes stays beneath the radar. The times require unconventional change in uncertainty – people who offer a kind of will for change, a willingness to adapt, to be differently, to persevere through discomfort, to then explore what’s possible and not simply what’s practical.

Aisha: And we know I value nonprofits so much. And leaders, who have for time – since time began – have been meeting a need, providing services that the financial resources have not been able to cover. And so how do we think about best supporting those nonprofits right now? It's going to require cross-sectoral approaches.

Marcus: Absolutely.

Aisha: We need local government to step up. We need grantmakers to be more creative and more flexible in their practices, to practice trust and to honor full costs of an operation. And we need more co-creation, co-design, and more community-centered approaches to the work.

Marcus: I couldn't have said it better. I'd be remiss if I didn't offer, add to that, that the most effective philanthropy, the most effective grantmaking in moments like this that are characterized by so much social, economic, and political change, are paying attention to their investments and advocacy and organizing. Where we offer the resources matters as much as how much, and the extent to which the cycles of our work align with the pace and cycles of change external to our work. But I’ll just double down–

Aisha: Thank you for offering that.

Marcus: Absolutely, thank you.

Aisha: I really enjoyed this conversation.

Marcus: Likewise, good to see you again.